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Henderson Castle Reviews

Henderson Castle View more information

Reviews

3.8 out of 5 rating
26 Reviews
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65% Recommended by couples
  • Casey
    Casey Sent on 06/10/2019
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    Beautiful castle

    Attended an event last year. Very professional, great food, wonderful staff. The rooms are so neat, and it’s nice the history has been reserved.
  • K
    Kelianne Sent on 06/22/2018
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    I absolutely loved Cortnee and the castle! I really enjoyed my wedding, and I was able to due to the minor details being taken care of for me. The available packages gave me everything I needed for a great deal. I'd absolutely recommend them to anyone looking for a beautiful venue with everything you need in one location. I honestly can't thank the castle enough for all the hard work they did to make my day special.

    Henderson Castle's reply:

    Thank you so much Kelianne. It was such a pleasure to work with you.
  • T
    Teryn Sent on 04/29/2018
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    We loved having our wedding here! It’s an exquisite venue

    Henderson Castle's reply:

    Thank you Teryn for allowing me to meet Robert and plan your wedding! It was an honor.
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  • R
    Rebecca Sent on 04/18/2018
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    Unique setting with exceptional service. Courtnee Lane and staff went above and beyond to make this a magical, fairytale experience. We would definitely recommend this venue to someone who is wanting a spectacular, intimate wedding. The castle is simply mesmerizing and the whole experience was unforgettable.

    Henderson Castle's reply:

    Thank you so much Rebecca. It was such a pleasure to work with you and Kelly to give you the wedding you wanted. =)
  • A
    Ashley Sent on 02/07/2018
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    I stumbled on the Henderson House by accident when looking for venues. I had never heard of it as it was out of town for us. I was in love just from pictures but could have never imagined how much more amazing it would be until our first walk through. I never even looked at any other venues after visiting this beautiful castle. Cortnee made planning the easiest thing ever, I am not sure how I could have done it without her! The day of the wedding I was never worried , never had any doubt of how the day would go and it was nothing but fireworks the whole time. The most beautiful wedding ever and we were so honored to be apart of this castle’s history! To have ours closest friends and family with us and able to stay the night was nothing but a dream. Chef was amazing and everything was customized to us. He is hands down my favorite chef ever! Amazingly talented!! Thank you to the Henderson House for making our dream wedding become a reality. We plan to visit a few times a year! They are now apart of our family as well!!
  • J
    Joel Sent on 10/12/2016
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    We were married October 1st, 2016.
    My now husband, wanted to have a fairy tale wedding. So what better place than a castle would fulfill his dream! We found Henderson Castle on a Google search and instantly fell in love. From our first contact with the Henderson staff until the moment we left the venue we were treated with the most respect, given exactly what we requested, and were shown exceptional customer service. We truly could not be happier with how our wedding day turned out. The character of the castle was beautiful day and night. The rooms that were offered to our guests were detailed with original artwork, woodwork, and incredible furnishings. The detail of the castle is like nothing we had ever seen before. Especially a place that allows guests to see, touch, and use the beautiful pieces. Our guests were truly surprised by how unique the place is. Within the castle there are many unique pictures, pieces of furniture, cool bathrooms, and even pianos, but the part that meant the most to us were the people/staff that took such good care of us and our guests. The castle wedding coordinator was so responsive to our emails and phone calls. She truly made our day come together and gave us everything we asked for and even more. The chefs and wait staff were so incredible throughout the night! The food was absolutely delicious, great presentation and great flavor. Our chef even made us a tray full of chocolates and joined us for a quick dance on the dance floor! These are memories we will never forget! The next day the exceptional castle experience continued. We had a wonderful brunch and later had a couple's massage. All of our guests couldn't be happier with their experience at Henderson Castle and we feel the same about our entire experience with Henderson Castle. We can truly say that our day was perfect!
  • User1485497 Sent on 12/28/2013
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    I had my wedding here at the castle on Dec 22nd 2013 and I can't say how much we loved it! Everything was gorgeously decorated for the Christmas atmosphere and we didn't have to do much at all to add to it. The staff was also wonderful to work with and always answered all of our questions promptly. They also helped us out so much on the wedding day with set up. We had our ceremony inside on the beautiful staircase, and the staff was able to accommodate all of our 90 guests. Many people said it was one of the most beautiful ceremonies they had ever seen!
    We then had a cocktail hour and the bartender (who was great and very knowledgeable/experienced) made a specialty candy cane martini just for our event. Guests were also free to look around the castle and loved seeing all of the different rooms and architecture. Dinner was amazing also! We had chicken, pork, or stuffed peppers with creamy tomato soup, rolls, and salad. The cake was custom designed by their pastry chef and made to look like a stack of Christmas gifts, everyone was very impressed and thought it was very unique.
    We had the reception upstairs in the ballroom and it was really fun. The DJ that the castle provided was great and took requests and did games with the guests all night long. We also had a photo booth upstairs which the guests loved (provided by studio 616). At the end of the night, my bridesmaids and I went up into the rooftop hot tub with our wine which was a perfect end to the night. Many of our wedding party and family members went down into the "man cave" to enjoy some after party drinks with the bartender which was a great way to wind down after the party.
    I had such a great experience at the castle and it honestly exceeded my expectations. I planned this wedding from Virginia since my husband
  • J
    Jessica Sent on 10/06/2013
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    Henderson Castle is the perfect setting for a fairytale wedding day. The architecture is stunning and all of our guests raved about the four course dinner. We had the entire castle, grounds and staff to meet all the needs of us and our guests. The spa onsite was a perfect way to prepare for the main event. Every anniversary will now be spent at Henderson Castle!
  • Linda
    Linda Sent on 08/06/2012
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    We held our reception at Henderson Castle in June and it was perfect from arrival to departure. Our 70 guests were welcomed with a cocktail hour: Champagne, fruit punch and hors d'oeuvres. This was followed by a four course dinner (salad, soup, entree, desert) - all courses were excellent and we received much positive feedback from our guests. The cake cutting was done very professionally by Francois Moyet and his assistant and was served as desert. Francois and his staff were the anchor for the event: Always of help and attentive but in the background (e.g. vase for my bridal bouquet). Francois supported the positive vibrations of our wedding with his friendly and patient character.
    The wedding party stayed in the seven guests rooms at Henderson Castle. After our guests had left, we switched to the lounge room and enjoyed talking to everybody before we went to bed late. The rooms are absolutely clean and the quality of the bedsheets made it a comfortable night. We had the "Italian Room" and were woken up by the sun tickling our noses in the morning. Staying in these unique rooms makes you feel like you traveled back in time to a luxurious 19th century! It's a one-of-a-kind experience!
    During breakfast we were surprised by a violin player who entertained the guests while we unwrapped our presents.
    Five stars because it was a perfect wedding for us in a dream location!
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    Nichole Sent on 03/29/2013
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    we could not have picked a better place to be married than the Henderson castle. The uniqe expiriance of being able to have my family and friends stay the night and have breakfast together in the morning was priceless. The castle and the property are gorgeous and the staff was beyond helpful and inviting. we rented out the whole castle for 24 hours. we were marrided in the court yard outside followed by photos. while we finished our photos our guest went inside for a drink and orderves before we all sat down to a very delicious 7 course dinner. we finshed our evening dancing in the ballroom and migeling on the roof top. It was magical. I would recommend the Henderson Castle to anyone looking to be married or hold an event .
  • C
    C Sent on 05/20/2018
    4.9 out of 5 rating
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    The staff at Henderson Castle is absolutely amazing; extremely knowledgeable and patient. The castle itself has a calming aura. An overall fantastic experience that makes for superior memories. Highly recommended.

    Henderson Castle's reply:

    Thank you Chandy.
  • User1825920 Sent on 09/23/2014
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    The Henderson Castle was the perfect venue for my daughter's wedding. The wedding planners were so accomodating and helpful throughout the entire process. They provided everything except we used our own photographer. The food was excellent! The entire staff worked very hard to make sure all was taken care of to our satisfaction. I would highly recommend.
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    Chelsea Sent on 06/01/2013
    4.7 out of 5 rating
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    Know that the staff at the castle are always willing to do or work with you on making your dream wedding come true. This does mean that although you've had conversations with them about your plans it is still always best to put it in writing so everyone knows. Even the simplest details help them accommodate all your needs. This is an old and unique venue so if you're looking for a gorgeous space this is it but don't always expect everything to be perfectly maintained or updated. That's part of its charm. It's a huge place to maintain and keep nice and they do their best but just like any home there's always a list I'm sure. The food is good, and Francois is a great chef. Talk to him and tell him what you do and don't like and he'll work with you. Enjoy the day and the views surrounding you and it'll be a fairy tale like ours was.
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    Evon Sent on 04/16/2013
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    It is the most beautiful and elegant of Venues, it is a diamond in the ruff, not to mention fit into our budget. The Staff and Event coordinator were amazing, they were a one stop shop. Anything that we did need they were more than helpful to accommodate.
  • S
    Sam Sent on 03/08/2018
    4.6 out of 5 rating
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    Overall our wedding was so beautiful and fun. There were some issue with seating chart which was disappointing since I spent tons of time on it. If I did it over I would have put the name cards on the seats myself. The service was a little chaotic bringing the food out, some of us had finished eating while others still hadn’t gotten food. I think this is a perfect place for a small intimate wedding but it was hard to manage so many people in such a small space. All of the people are so kind, however. Very attentive I think they just need more employees for bigger events. The food was absolutely outstanding, and my husband and I plan on making this our anniversary spot. Overall amazing just a couple of smalll improvements and it would be perfect.
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    Emma Sent on 11/13/2013
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    the Henderson Castle is an elegant, unique venue for any special event or dinner. all the staff, especially the owner Francois, are professional and easy to work with. they have experience so the planning and preparation was not stressful. we simply shared our vision and goals, and they met all of our needs. it´s important to put things in writing though and we recommend you ask about the all the fees upfront (e.g. taxes and gratuity). overall the wedding package is worthwhile because it includes all the elements for the special day.
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    Tammy Sent on 09/19/2016
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    We stayed here for our wedding, but did not have the wedding service here. I rented the whole castle (Except for 2 rooms that were previously rented) along with the house across the street. We were allowed to check in early so we could get ready for our wedding and have pictures taken. We arrived at 2pm. Our rooms were ready. The bar was closed and did not open for a few more hours. That was a bit disappointing, but they did get me a glass of Riesling which was out of this world! The accommodations were very comfortable. We stayed in a very small room-the Queens Tower, a room just big enough to house the bed. It had its own private balcony. This room was perfect for us on our wedding night. It was on the third floor, in the back of the ballroom, away from all the other rooms in the castle. It was quite cozy and romantic. We loved it! There is a new hot tub on the rooftop that we didn't use because we had no time too, but is a wonderful little piece of heaven when there is time. The staff were very accommodating to my dad who had some special needs for his room. We absolutely loved having our pictures done at the castle. The castle grounds were beautiful. We loved staying the night here also. Such a wonderful place. Our biggest disappointment came in the morning, when we got up at breakfast time and there were no staff at the castle yet. There was no coffee in the morning. We are huge coffee drinkers so this is a huge deal and causes panic when you get up and there is no coffee and no way to get coffee. A staff member did show up an hour late and it seemed that the morning staff person may have done a no call no show that caused the issue of no coffee. These things happen is not part of the norm. We eventually got our coffee and our breakfast then we checked out and started our honeymoon! We plan on staying at Henderson Castle again for our 1st anniversary. We are looking so forward to it! Thank you to all of the employees at Henderson!
  • K
    Katherine Sent on 07/31/2019
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    Some hiccups but overall good

    What started out as a rough experience was turned into a good one by the assistant wedding coordinator doing everything he could to ensure the day went smoothly.
  • User2725488 Sent on 08/15/2016
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    The venue was beautiful! In the contract it said they would help us decorate morning of and no one was there to help us decorate. I was still decorating at 2:30 when the wedding started at 3. The staff and wedding planner was very responsive. Dinner was delicious but small portions and dinner took quite a while to be served because for over 100 guests they only had two servers.
  • Corrina
    Corrina Sent on 09/09/2019
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    Fairly Priced

    I had a good experience with Henderson Castle. Their wedding coordinator Courtnee took the time to walk us through our big day and what to expect. She went over the timelines and explained how she could assist and make our day less stressful. Unfourtanetly she quit a few months after we signed on. She was one of the main reasons we chose Henderson Castle, so it was disappointing. Julie Robinson took over as our wedding coordinator after Courtnee left. Unfortunately, she did not know what she was doing. She would ask the same questions over and over every-time we saw her. She would take days to answer our texts and even said we would be responsible to set up the decorations, Although the contract said otherwise. Two months before the wedding she sent us a text saying she was fired, because of a mishap with the DJ. Julie's assistant Shannon took over as our wedding coordinator and she was a godsend. She knew exactly what we wanted and got it done. I honestly have no idea how we could have done it without her. My wedding day was great. The only thing I would change is the DJ. We purchased the all-inclusive package which included the DJ. He had us create a playlist for the reception but he only played 5 of the 50 songs we requested.
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    Carolynn Z. Sent on 12/02/2021
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    Stay Away - Unprofessional & Overpriced

    Henderson Castle once seemed a dream venue for our wedding; however, we have discovered from experience and reviews on other sites (including Trip Advisor and Wedding Wire) that under the current ownership a wedding on their property would be a nightmare. In emails leading up to our wedding tour, there were several small miscommunications that were easy to look over. However, once we arrived to Henderson Castle on October 23rd for our scheduled wedding tour even the charm of the manager couldn't cover up the inadequacy of the owner. When we entered the castle, we noticed two gentlemen visibly upset about something. Neither greeted us and there was no one at the front counter (we later learned that one of the two gentlemen was the owner).
    Nevertheless, within about 5-10 minutes after our scheduled time the manager did come to greet us. There was initially some confusion thinking we had booked just a tour for a Bridal Party, but despite that initial confusion the manager did take us on the full wedding tour. However, one of the first things we were told was that they were in a situation because the owner believes he knows best about everything and does not listen to the experts in their areas. Yikes! No wonder it looked like the owner was having a hard time when we came in. But, we decided to overlook that as they were preparing for a Murder Mystery night and we have no idea what the severity of that "situation" was. Admittedly, the rest of the tour was nice. The manager is the one who guided the tour and he has an amazing personality. He really sold the place and I left really wanting to celebrate my wedding there. The rooftop has a gorgeous view, the bar area has a beautifully painted ceiling with lights embedded to mimic stars, the dining area looked wonderful. They were pricey for our wedding budget, but we wanted to work out a custom wedding package & were even willing to spend extra than we initially planned because we loved the venue so much. After the tour, I was told the manager's assistant would get back to me shortly.
    Admittedly, I was still very excited about the venue and decided to email on October 27th, though I hadn't heard from them yet. In the email, I included our budget, stated the services we knew we would want, requested pricing on other services we weren't sure of, and included the information that my future in-laws would also pay for us to have the rehearsal dinner there (and the minimum for the rehearsal dinner is the same as for the wedding dinner so that would have been quite a generous gift).
    As of today (November 30th) I have not heard back. I suppose we were lucky. It was only a couple days after sending that email that I found numerous negative reviews saying that the owner attempted to break wedding contracts, charge extra for services that were included in the contract, wrote fake reviews stating people had wonderful weddings at the Henderson Castle when the wedding was actually disastrous, and that the owner was entering people into a raffle to get a tv if they wrote a good review for Henderson Castle. There were several reviews that stated families had to get lawyers involved due to corrupt acts of the owner! And the amount of people that said the food was inadequate was alarming. When I told my future mother-in-law about this her friend even said she went to a wedding there recently and the food at the wedding was bad! Now, in case you don't know, Henderson Castle requires that you buy your food through them and there is a $3,500 food and beverage minimum for bother the wedding dinner & rehearsal dinner...
    I wish the Henderson Castle had a different owner. The area it's located in has special significance for my fiancee and I. The grounds are beautiful and the castle has charm. I even believe that the manager would have been a great wedding coordinator from my interactions with him. But I can't risk my wedding being ruined by one man who doesn't listen to others and has ruined weddings. We are now looking into The Nordic Pineapple, which we have heard is owned by wonderful innkeepers. Though they are not in our ideal location, we are happy to sacrifice the location for a venue with competent, kind owners.
  • Katelyn
    Katelyn S. Sent on 04/12/2021
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    $5,800 for half of an engagement shoot and a tasting.

    I really wanted this to work, I loved the architecture of the Henderson Castle, but unfortunately our experience was not good. The Henderson Castle can not keep the same event planner for more than a year, some vendors wont even work with them, that is probably why they have almost all of the vendors you need prehired and you can't change them, but if you want a photo booth or something it is pretty much out of the question. When Covid hit my husband and I decided our best course of action was to postpone, since our entire guest list could not attend, and the Henderson castle could not accommodate my 100 people. They charged us $2000 to postpone to 2021, and we didn't believe that canceling was an option because in the contract it says that we still have to pay the full amount no matter what because they are not liable for "acts of god." Their food was okay at best for our tasting, but the fish had all of the bones still inside, so they may kill one of your guests. Finally we decided that the Henderson castle was too sketchy for our liking, and made a deal with francois to pay an extra $2,500 to get out of the contract. We paid in total $5,800 that we will never get back for galf of an engagement shoot, a tasting (that occurred while a party was going on) and to go back to square one with all of our wedding plans. We do not recommend them they are a scam. Oh and somehow they raised my price almost $5,000 that they could not or would not explain after we moved our date without a new contract. The wedding photographer was great, but she no longer works for them for some unknown reason either, her name was Rebecca Burgen and I 100% recommend her.
  • K
    Katelyn Sent on 04/12/2021
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    $17,708.22 for a rip off

    DO NOT BOOK ANY SPECIAL EVENT WITH THE HENDERSON CASTLE!
    Pros: Pretty Building

    Cons:
    -No Air Conditioning
    -No elevator
    -Ballroom on 3rd floor
    -Can't Keep Staff meaning the photographer and wedding planner you start with wont be there for your wedding
    -3% fee for credit/debit card use =EXTRA $532.25
    -Clause in contract that makes you have to pay the entire wedding no matter what including "acts of god."
    -Can't even be on the roof past 10 pm
    -a lot of vendors wont work with them
    -They do not debone their fish so if your guests aren't careful they may die.
    -Can't taste the vegetarian option at your tasting
    -Don't have the ingredients to taste all of the hour 'devours at the tasting, you have to pick two that you can try, but if you don't like them you are out of luck.
    - Cost $2,000 to change the date because of covid, even though they couldn't accommodate my guest count
    -Couldn't or wouldn't explain the $500 increase on my bill
    -You have to pay for the ceremony, even if you don't have it there.
    -They advertise 100 guest max, but 100 people wont fit in the dining room causing you to be separated from some or most of your guests.
    -Paid $5,800 for half of an engagement shoot and a tasting.
    -you can only bring 2 people to the tasting so your entire wedding party cant have their opinions.
    FINAL OPINION
    DO NOT USE THE HENDERSON CASTLE FOR ANY EVENTS
  • J
    Josh Sent on 07/11/2019
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    Really a beautiful building, however....

    Groom here, if you can only read one part of this review, DO NOT hold your wedding here or hold another event here. PERIOD.

    This establishment/Francios the owner, tried it's hardest to give my new wife and myself the most miserable wedding planning and event execution they possibly could, or so it seemed.


    My wife has previously submitted her review explaining exactly how they have done this, please read her review on Facebook! However, as time passes and we continue to hear many new horror story's from many of our guests. Fortunately, our friends and family kept these stories hidden from us because they cared so much that my wife and I experienced the greatest day of our lives, despite the crumbling foundation of Francois' house of mirrors and deception.

    NEW DETAILS

    We recently found out that our assistant photographer was moved away from her main task of photographing the wedding party by the ONLY wedding coordinator. Don't forget, we were supposed to have three..
    The reason she was forced away, was to help her light all of the candles. We had hundreds of candles, it was a year long project we worked on together for the wedding. The photographer was away from her post for 45 minutes. Both the bride and myself thought the assistant was taking pictures elsewhere, the photographer thought the same..

    I can not comprehend how a PROFESSIONAL wedding coordinator could think it was a good idea to tear away one of the only people whose job it is to be with the bride and groom at this point.
    This is yet another example of understaffing.


    We didn't mention the heat, mostly just the rain, but it was HOT. This is understandably a beautiful old building and is not energy efficient, but the air conditioning window units provided in all guest rooms, were ancient. And the filters were disgusting. Our friend checked out the air filter in his room air-conditioning unit before going to bed because it seemed to not be blowing very much. To his surprise it was disgusting, so much so that he had to clean it so his wife and himself would not be breathing in the disgusting air.

    As we have previously said we were charged $500 to keep the bar open 2 hours later, not including the $250 fee the DJ charged.. So the money was only for the 2 bartenders.

    On theknot.com the Henderson castle has a page that allows you to see all the details and prices of the different wedding packages.
    -A section on the knot called Bartender Additional Hour states: Each additional hour $50 per hour. Bartender Service Requirements: 1 bartender per 50 guests.

    Hmm, so for two bar tenders for two hours we should have been charged $200, which would be reasonable, if they could handle pouring simple kegged cocktails and beer…. But wait, they apparently didn't know how to pump a keg and all day all they were pouring was foam.

    Beds were terrible… One groomsmen fell out of bed because it was a queen foam mattress on a full size frame, so he had to sleep in a different bed than his wife.. Unacceptable.

    There now appears to be a fake reviewer who knows an awful lot about the details of our wedding last weekend named Bob Arrh… I nor the Bride have ever known anyone by this name, he also claims he proposed to his girlfriend at our wedding.. That is a complete lie. We are not sure who this is, but have looked into tons of old 5 star reviews of Henderson Castle that also are a bit fishy.



    Overall our issue with the Henderson castle is feeling we were cheated out of money by Francios the owner, the level of service we were promised was not even close to the level we received, they were understaffed, and unprepared for an event of our size. I would like to advise everyone considering a stay or wedding at this "bed and breakfast" to absolutely reconsider.


  • User1253479 Sent on 07/23/2013
    1 out of 5 rating
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    I would not recommend this venue to anyone that has a wedding with more than 50people including the wedding party. The current management is not upfront with critical logistics like maximum occupancy of 65 in the third floor ballroom, the downstairs dining room is set up for 44 people, with a separate room that can hold 19 more people. The elevator is broken so if you have any guests with mobility issues they will not be able to get to the third floor ballroom. The parking lot holds approximately 15 cars and since it is on top of a hill your guests will have to walk up the driveway and park on the street if the parking lot is full. We were under the understanding that drinks (coffee/Tea/Soda) came with the dinner but found out during our reception that they were charging our guests for all of the above. The wait staff and the girls that work there are nice, but the man they work for is difficult to work with, he will tell you he owns the castle, but if you look up the state of michigan records, it is owned by a man that runs a car detail shop on westmain street. We were told(and its in the contract) we would have the entire property for 24 hours, but people were coming in for lunch the next day before we were even checked out. The rooftob hottub was a selling point, but it was sealed off with 5 gallon buckets, and the hours of operation in the handbook in the room indicated we couldnt use it after 10pm. Given that the reception lasted until midnight, and we left the next morning, we couldnt use the hot tub at all. The complimentary couples massage was dissapointing, they set up two massage tables in the lounge area that is open to the ballroom, hallway, and rooftop so when they started the massage, people literally walked through. The wedding cake was fabulous, the pastry chef did an exceptional job.

    Henderson Castle's reply:

    Most of the information you are posting is untrue. Our main dining room has a capacity for 70 people and the private dining room seats 20. Our upstairs ballroom holds another 70 people for dancing or dinner. These capacities are set by the fire department and we do not allow more guests in each room for your safety. These capacities are explained when you book your wedding. There is an elevator on the property (original to the Castle 1895) it has been out of service for over 30 years and we never imply that it will magically be working for your event. All wedding tours are taken up to the 3rd floor, and anyone booking a wedding here is aware that any guests attending events in the ballroom will have to use these stairs. We have 33 parking spots in our lot and ample free parking in the neighborhoods surrounding the Castle. Again anyone booking a wedding is aware of our parking lot size when they first view the Castle. Soda packages ( and any drinks) are in addition to the cost of a meal. They are not listed as included on any menu in print or on-line and you would have been asked at your catering meeting if you wish to include a soda package. Had you declined, we would have charged the guests for the soda they consumed. The roof top closes at 10 pm along with all outdoor activity. It is a city ordinance. We are located in a residential neighborhood. The hot tub is never sealed off. We do have weights on the cover so it does not blow off, again for your safety. We are not open for business to the public during the 24 hours you reserve the castle. We do occasionally have walk-in business that comes in. We respectfully explain that we are closed for a private event and they move on. Our lunch service starts at 12 pm the same time your contracted time ended. The massage area is locked while massages are being conducted. We host weddings of 100+ guests here regularly and have very happy brides and grooms. The amount of disinformation you are posting here has me questioning when you had your wedding here. Henderson Castle Bed & Breakfast is owned by Francois Moyet. We appreciate your kind words for our pastry chef and will pass them on to her.
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